You Can't Rush Math Art

Hey everybody, it's Cheri Dotterer
here at Tier One Interventions podcast.

I'm here today with Jonily Zupancic
and we are in class today with a live

group of ladies and gentlemen who are
learning about the Mastery Math method.

So I'm gonna let Jonily talk and if
there's any intervention that I wanna add

to the puzzle, we will do but for now,
I'm signing it all over to Jonily and let

us learn a little bit about mathematics.

Girl.

Y'all, this is Jay-Z.

I'm Jonily Zupancic, I'm your math
specialist, your main Mathineer.

I if you are listening to this podcast or
you're watching this podcast on YouTube I

want to give a disclaimer and a warning.

This is level two.

You're listening in on a level two
version of Mastery Math method.

The reason we do explicit direct
instruction is so that we can have

these tangents, then we can come
back because those tangents are

when the best learning is created.

This is what the flavor of instruction
is in the mastery math method.

We're modeling this for you right now.

Everything I'm doing with you,
I want you to do with your kids.

So yes, we're still teaching standards,
we're still doing direct explicit

instruction, but in between those
times, we're doing bursts of conceptual,

experiential, contextual storytelling.

Okay?

Student four touches their own
locker first, not starts at four,

touches locker four first, and then
touches every multiple of four.

So student four, and when I say
touches, I mean changes the state.

If it's open, it's closed, closed up.

So student four changes, locker
4, 8, 12, 16, 20, and 24.

Now some of you are losing your ever
loving minds right now if you're if you're

watching the visual portion of this, some
of you are losing your ever loving minds

right now because you went into teaching
because you are type A control freak.

You went into teaching math because
you're even more type A control freak.

And I need you to change.

I need you to change tomorrow.

Actually, yesterday I need you to change.

Okay?

Are you hearing me?

Because if you're able to see this
visual right now, you're freaking

out because you're gonna say

your paper is a mess.

Those numbers aren't even in order.

There's not even,

you're gonna be like this.

This is the worst way
for students to learn.

And I'm gonna say it's the best
way students to learn your type.

A control freak mentality is the barrier
to your student ultimate learning.

You've got to change.

Guess what?

Half the people listening to
this just turned off the podcast.

I don't care.

Go.

My point is, math is messy.

I do not give my students
lined paper to do math on.

They either get blank paper with
nothing on it, or they get graph paper.

Or they get a math tool, like a one
20 chart or a dot paper or something.

And I told my students last
week, if you want lined paper to

take math notes on you, do you?

That's great.

I'm not gonna give it to you.

You'll need to bring your own,
because I'm never going to force

you to do math on lined paper.

But some of you really need
the line paper to do the math.

So you'll need to bring that, just
get one of those 25 cent spiral

notebooks from Walmart and bring it
in and use that for your math notes.

Math must be messy to be mastered.

Jazz hands, math must, and the
OT would give you, and the OT

would pull out the grid paper
and make sure you can line it up.

So math must be messy

to achieve mastery.

Now, if you loved what I said, you're
gonna spirit hands, but me as the

presenter of that are gonna jazz hands.

Do you see?

I'm gonna now, but
Cheri, now wait a minute.

Because if we are in a conceptual
exposure, maybe only interaction one,

two, or three of something, I don't wanna
fix the lining up for kids right away.

And Cheri knows this 'cause like her
job as an OT is to help kids with

the systems and structures, okay?

But first they need to be messy.

So this locker game board
is gonna be draft one.

Just like in language arts, when
you're writing, the first time you

write is not the final paper, and
we need more of that in mathematics.

Math must be messy before mastery.

Math must be messy before mastery.

There's plenty of time to
take all the messy stuff.

And then to Cheri's point, as an
ot, as the classroom teacher, as

the intervention specialist, we're
gonna take their messy draft one.

We're gonna label it as draft one.

We're gonna frame it, we wanna frame
the messy, we wanna frame the draft one.

Then we want kids to do the same
locker note taking as a draft two,

draft three, draft four, and it's
going to become more organized and

systematic as we continue the drafts.

Then we're going to say to
students, you know what?

We're gonna give you a new game board
that's gonna have boxes in the boxes, and

now we're gonna help you mathematically
notate in a more organized way.

But at first in our explicit
direct instruction, we can't start

with the ultimate organization.

We have to start with a messy note taking.

And you've just seen a model of
this, but if you're a type A control

freak teacher, which most of you are,
you need to get over that and give

kids these draft one opportunities.

Okay?

So get back to the math.

Natalie.

Natalie's in the back of my head here.

She's poking me.

She's poking me.

She's Jolie, hello.

Hello.

Okay, student number five is
going to touch multiples of five.

Now this is gonna get a lot quicker
as we go, and I can stop at every

moment and ask kids, what do you see?

What do you notice?

And you are gonna notice that we're gonna
get a lot faster as we're going here.

Six changes.

6, 12, 18, 24.

Okay, seven.

I'm just trying to find a good color here.

I guess I can use this one.

Seven is gonna do seven.

14, 21. Oh.

And I could say to kids, what are the
next three numbers that seven is gonna do?

Seven.

Did seven touch 7, 14, 21.

What are the next three numbers?

Boom.

I can practice flat
fact fluency right here.

Right here in the middle of this.

Okay.

And then we're gonna do eight.

And yes, I'm gonna take the
time to do this and I'm gonna

do this in front of my class.

This is the explicit
direct instruction part.

Wow.

Let me stop for a minute.

Wait a minute.

Let me stop.

Hold the phone.

Hold the phone.

Stop the train.

Okay.

For all of you that are
here live, what do you see?

And notice right now, unmute
or type it in the chat.

What do you see?

What do you notice?

Unmute.

Type it in the chat.

What do you see?

What do you notice?

Four has an odd number
of students touching it.

Spirit

fingers.

Hey everybody, it's Cheri again.

If you're loving these strategies
and you want to join our Mastery

Math Method Masterclass, we hold
this hour long event once a month

and we'd love to have you join.

What we talk about there is how to
improve your math skills in 10 days.

Can you imagine 10 days, whether you
are a math teacher or an occupational

therapist, you can see exactly how to
shift teaching so that every student,

no matter their starting point, can
master core math concepts and reserve.

So reserve your seat today and go
over to disability labs.com/calendar

to check out the next event.

What else do you notice?

Yeah, Kathy.

Kathy.

Notices factors.

You fancy.

You fancy

Amy?

I love it.

I love it.

Amy is, okay.

Look, Amy is the one person I
know that is the highest level

of type A. Would you agree, Amy?

Like you are the ultimate type A person.

I'm the ultimate not type A person.

Would you agree?

Yes.

Okay.

And Amy says, I love this.

It looks organized to me, Sarah.

See there's a, there's an organization
that is stupid and then there's a

messy organization that Amy loves
as the ultimate type A person.

And this is what that is.

Amy, great point.

I wanna add one thing here.

Sure.

And if your students are starting to
get a little bit of disconnected to the

engagement in the classroom, when I get
to number eight, I'm bringing out the

interlace bilateral integration and I
am making 'em stand up and do the eight

Cheri, tell us more about that for
people that just need a little more.

Sure.

There are three types of
bilateral integration.

There is symmetrical.

So if you think about your both
hands are doing the same thing

at the same time doing the thing.

So I talk about karate kid, brush
on wax off, wax on, wax off.

Your arms are doing the
same thing at the same time.

They're painting that, that fence.

Okay, you can be going this way.

They're basically, they're both
crossing your you at the same time.

You're doing the same movement.

Asymmetrical bilateral integration
is like my example is writing one

hand's, holding the paper, the
other hand's doing the scribble.

Hopefully not scribble,
but you get my point.

And then there's a third type of bilateral
integration and that is trying to get

both sides of the brain doing the same
thing at the same time at a central point.

And that's why I bring
both hands together.

I keep my hands facing away from me.

Bring one behind the other,
interlace my fingers.

The hand that's on the outside
hopefully is the writing hand.

So they can mimic that three jaw chuck
that they need to use when they have a

pencil in their hand to be able to write.

So if they're gonna write their eight

in the air, they got both hands doing it.

The benefit of doing interlace
bilateral integration is you bring the

logic brain, the creative brain, the
subconscious brain and the spiritual

brain together all at the same time.

And you make sure you really integrate
it well into your memory so that

it comes back for long-term memory.

And it also creates the movement.

So you're gonna reengage
the brain with novelty.

Holy.

Cheri,

you are dropping bombs today, woman.

Okay.

All right, friends, here we go.

We always say we work
best when we don't plan.

Hey I'm telling you,
planning is so overrated.

Planning is stupid.

Thank you for saying that out loud.

Planning is stupid, but yet that's
what the entire discussion was

on Wednesday night was planning.

Oh man.

Oh, we need to oh, that's good.

Oh, Cheri, we need to expand on this.

Not right now, 'cause I'm doing
nines and then I'm doing 10 changes.

Locker 10 and 20, and then 10 changes.

30, 40, 50, 60. And then student 11.

I'm running outta colors.

I can use gray student 11.

Oh my gosh.

Look at this.

What do you guys notice?

I'm ready to put the 11 in the 11 box.

The only number that's on
locker 11 right now is one.

So student 11 is finally going it's
finally student eleven's turn and

student 11 is gonna take change.

Box 11 and 22 and then 33, 44, 55.

But look

guys, look at box 11 right now.

I'm doing that in white
and it didn't show up.

That was dumb.

Hold on a second.

I need a way to make this profound.

Let's just use let's just use Lime green.

Look at box 11.

Look at locker 11 right now.

When student, when it was
finally student eleven's turn

and student 11 touched locker 11.

The only other person that had touched
it at that time was student one.

So is locker 11 gonna be opened or closed?

Does lock, is locker 11
gonna be opened or closed?

Locker 11 is gonna be closed forever
because how many students touch locker?

11. Forever and ever.

And ever.

No matter how many students we have
two students only, and exactly two

students are gonna touch locker 11.

Which students are going to touch
locker 11, student one and student 11.

Now, I forgot to say this at the
beginning, but all the lockers

start closed when we begin the game,
all of the lockers start closed.

Okay?

All the lockers start closed.

So student one opened locker 11
and student 11, closed locker 11.

Now I'm doing a lot of telling of this
to you because you're at a training

and you're adults and I'm teaching
you, and I'm telling you, telling

is not the most effective form of
instruction for ultimate learning.

So I would facilitate what I just did with
all of you different in the classroom.

Just know that in the classroom I would
say, oh guys, tell me about locker 11.

Turn and talk about locker 11.

And I would have the kids tell me,
okay, I did that a little different

because we're on a professional
development training podcast ish.

You're adults you want to be told
you're coming here 'cause you wanna

be told things 'cause you wanna grow.

So it's just, it's a different situation.

But in classrooms with kids, I wouldn't
have facilitated it exactly that way.

I want that point to be made for sure.

And here's another quote of mine.

If I as the teacher say it, kids hear it.

Which is fine, which totally fine, but
hearing it does not lead to mastery.

Okay.

So if I say it, they hear it, but if
they, the students say it, they learn it.

If I say it, they hear it.

If they say it, they learn it.

So I can say it.

I'm not telling you to stop
saying things you need to say

and tell and direct and dah.

You just can't, as the teacher have the
expectation that they're going to learn

it when we say it, they may not learn it.

They're only going to hear it.

Gosh, let me say that again.

If we as the teacher say it, if we as the
parent say it, if we as the adult say it,

if we say it, they are not necessarily
going to learn it and master it.

We just need to know
that we need to be real.

Just because I say it does not
mean they're gonna learn it.

They'll hear it, but
they're not gonna learn it.

They might, but they most likely will not.

In order for them to
learn it, they have it.

So somebody unmute right now because
I'm gonna make you say what I just said.

We're gonna use Natalie's method
that is not yet named, but this

is gonna be a profound turning
point in all of education.

Natalie, we're using Natalie's method.

Somebody right now, tell me what
I just said in your own words.

Unmute and tell us.

That's fine.

I'm not gonna make you,
I'm not gonna make you.

Yep.

So Beth, Cheri answered that the
all of level one has exactly what

you need to get to this level.

Oh, good.

Perfect.

Okay.

Thank you.

Yep.

Don't let this scare you away.

Put what they have this locker
chart in front of them as well

as feeling it as, yes, Theresa.

Good.

Good.

Okay.

You guys are carrying on in the chat.

You're good.

Okay.

Now I'm ready to be 12.

See it.

And it's important that I
just take the time on this.

This is not wasting time.

This is you all that have seen the
locker 47 times have never seen me do

it like this, so it's worth the time,

so chill the heck out.

Okay, so what other lockers?

So Student 12 is gonna touch
Locker 12 and 24 on my chart,

but also 36, oh, guess what?

Do you guys remember?

The 12 song?

I'm a big fan of the 12 song with kinders.

I teach kinders the 12 song
and then we use it every grade.

12, 20, 36 48, 6 7 2 8, 4 96, 1 0
8, 1 2 21 32. Let's do one more.

1 44 Jazz hands.

Okay, moving on.

Let's do this one.

Okay, that's fine.

So what am I on?

I'm on 13 here.

Oh,

son of a junior.

Okay.

Oh, that's not a good color.

Because see, it's not, shoot.

I'm gonna use that.

That made that a three and not a two.

Oh shoot guys.

That must mean more about
done today 'cause Okay.

It is 1122.

Dear.

I know.

So student 13, I just did this.

Now what I'm gonna do with my students
is I'm gonna be like, tell me about this.

'cause they're gonna be like, now
they're gonna be like so chatty.

I'm gonna be like, okay.

In your groups.

In your groups, just talk to each other.

Go

Amy.

See, Amy teaches first graders.

Okay.

She's probably not gonna teach
all of this to her first graders.

Maybe she will, but Amy.

Is going to have a huge learning
shift mathematically this year.

Amy, you're gonna love level
two of Mastery Math Methods

year one intervention so much.

'cause this isn't about
your kids this year, Amy.

This is about you.

Level two is about you learning
the mathematics, not what you're

gonna be teaching to your kids.

That's the point of all of this.

You're a doll.

You are so much Dolly.

Dolly.

Okay.

And then on my specific game board here,
and let me just use blue because 14 now.

Oops.

Nope.

No.

Nope.

I wanted to use blue.

I wanted to use blue.

Okay.

14 now is gonna do 14.

And there's not a 28,
but 15 is gonna change.

15. And there's not a 30
and 16 is gonna change.

16. So this is students get
confused on this 'cause they're

like, but there's no other numbers.

Yeah, but there's one.

They're afraid to have that student
touch their own locker, even though

that's what we've done all along.

But it's yeah, there's only
one, but you gotta do that.

You gotta, even though you know I could
do 20, 40, 60, 80, it's not there.

We don't do it.

But we still have to like student 22
still touches Locker 22, student 23.

Ah, Amy.

Amy, this is your number,

Amy.

See, and I think if you make a big
deal about the turn and talk on

11 oh my goodness, wait a minute.

What just happened?

It hasn't been touched since.

Nu since person number
one, locker number one.

And then they'll be like, wait a
minute, 13 then was the exact same

and now 23, it only had the first
person and themselves touch it.

Like I think they'll see that connection.

How can you not?

Yeah.

Do you see what I mean?

How can you not?

How can you not But now wait a minute.

We can't do this on the first
interaction of locker problem.

This is not the first time
kids see locker problem.

It's probably not even the fifth
time kids see locker problem.

We can't, you can't rush
art that comes from a movie.

What is it?

Is it Buzz Lightyear or
Toy Story or something?

You can't rush art.

I think it's toy story.

Anyway, what I'm saying
is you can't rush this.

You can't do all of this the first,
like you can't do a week of locker

problem every day Monday through Friday
and then check it off your list and

be like, I've done locker problem.

It doesn't work that way.

You need to do locker problem exposure
one where they just play in season one.

Then you might do locker problem three
times in season two where they just

play again, you're still not doing this.

It might not be until kids have
done locker problem for the 15th

time that we finally say you guys
have seen locker problem 14 times.

Today we're gonna do it differently.

I'm gonna give you the game board,
but no pieces and we're gonna

take notes on the locker problem.

So this is Amy's number 23.

So locker 23, student 23.

The first locker student, 23 touches
is locker 23 and then 46 and so on.

As we wrap this series, we’ll zoom out.

In our final segment of this series,
we’ll connect all these interventions

back to the bigger picture of mastery
math, how division, storytelling,

puzzles, and perseverance fit
together to transform classrooms.

Until then, remember.

every student deserves the chance to
see themselves as a mathematician.

And as Cheri and Jonily
say, Go Be Awesome!

Go Be Brilliant!

For you were put here
for such a time as this.